Considering the first option, i guess most directory sites using this have a low pagerank. Am i correct? Because most pageranks are passed to outside links. And search engines will see your pages as no content because you only link out to others.
For second option, i was using the tracking and found it useful. I guess most directory websites using this have high page rank because of no external links at all. But since someone said in somewhere that this triggers the Google penalty because of webmasters 302 others page.
For third, some webmasters are suggesting not to use this because of ehtical issue. Masking others link are not ethical for some webmasters.
For fourth, never tried this, might give it a try?
What is your opinion? Feel free to correct me if i am wrong. I am still debating with myself of which options should i choose here.
As for #2 WSN Links uses 301 permanent redirects, not 302 temporary redirects, so it doesn't have that problem.
The most important thing is to do what is best for your viewers, then the traffic/rank will follow.
BTW, SE spiders can follow 301 and 302 redirects, so I don't think there is any difference between option 1 and 2. Unless you specify with "nofollow" tag, robots.txt, or in the header.
In general, if you provide links to high quality sites of a specific interest in a unique way, then this service will provide you with more traffic than the traffic that you would loose from the small reduction in page rank you were referring to.
As an example, look at DMOZ, they didn't loose all their page rank, and they don't do any shady stuff to try and keep it.
Yahoo uses redirects, but you still get PR from the yahoo dir.
SE Spiders can foolow 301 and 302? I did not know that.
And nofollow tag seems to be a myth sice some webmasters said that might be good or might be bad. And if i put a nofollow tag on every link, that will be a lot of nofollows.
Talking about shady stuff, i use a javascipt onmouseover trick to hide affiliate links. Is this recommended?
Also, i heard that the onclick trick can be used to prevent pr from passing. From WW forum.
Erm, i have been thinking a while and i need some suggestions.
I have a main site with a pr of 4. I am using direct linkout for external links. e.g. http://externallink.com instead of the tracking feature of WSN links. But i think i can boost up my pagerank by using the tracking feature and by putting up a robots.txt file indicating a disallow on mysite.com/links/
I thought of this because i am thinking search engines might think that my site has no content at all due to all external links.
But the problem is my link partners may be frowned upon what i did because i changed all to redirect feature. What do you guys think?
BTW, i run a craft directory websites listing all craft resources.
I think you might be wasting a lot of time on worrying about PR and outbound links. The advice a few posts up was about as good as you can get: worry about your viewers and users, traffic will follow.
Not to open the PR/Google can of worms but, here's my 2 cents worth of highlights: -PR is a stale tool, Google themselves suggest not using it for anything more than anecdotal assessments. -The practice of hording your PR by disguising outbound links will actually harm you with the current algorithyms, you should have at least 1-2 relevant outbound links to sites that fit the page topic. -Link partners aren't worth a whole lot; sites that exchange links don't get much credit. -Using all those nofollows along with javascript tricks is bound to get you penalized sooner or later.
If your concern is getting to the top of the results pages fast for a short amount of time, using whatever techniques you please. But if you want to build a site that has a long term presence, stay away from anything questionable.
I have a site that was created three years ago. It was on page 1 for several key terms on G for awhile, then Florida (a Google algorythym update) came along and sent me to the cellar. Seems all those META tags,ALT tages, and other content stuffing techniques I was using killed me. I didn't really get to concerned since, Yahoo changed at almost the same time and was sending me traffic to make up for that.
I recently stripped all that spammy content and overhauled the site (adding a few hundred pages). Soon after the Google traffic started coming back and Yahoo remains steady.
My advice would be to keep your content freash & clean and restrict your code use.
-Link partners aren't worth a whole lot; sites that exchange links don't get much credit.
I run a directory website and there is nothing except oubound links with some description and some more details pages. So if you are looking for "contents" on my site, then the description and outbound links are considered as content. I am adding a lot of links lately and now my site exceeds 1600 links.
And if you say that links partners arent worth a penny, then there will be no value to my whole site. Since what i am doing now is putting others links up and exchange with them.
ANyways, i think i wont do anything to change the sructure for now. Making quite a penny for myself advertising. :>
There are plenty of Directories out there that rank really well with nothing but catagorized outbound links. Search Engines understand directories, IMO, and expect thousands of outbound links from them. What's going to hurt you is when all of the sites you link have a link right back to you on their pages. This type of link exchange has been out of favor for years.
Now, if you can get inbound links from sites without having to link to them, you're cooking with gas.
What's going to hurt you is when all of the sites you link have a link right back to you on their pages. This type of link exchange has been out of favor for years.
I think reciprocal links still work but not as much benefit as one way link of course. My directory is built up upon reciprocal links mostly. I get some natural links of coruse but they are less than 100 i guess. While reciprocal links i get like 1000+
On the contrary, the practice is called link farming and can get you bounced right out of any relevant position in SERPs. It's a big no-no; a few won't probably hurt you but I'd think the amounts you are talking is putting you in danger. Do a Google search for "define:Link Farming" and you'll get their take on the practice of exchanging links.
Link farming is completely different from real link trading. Running Zeus or the like is not the same as exchanging links, and search engines are smart enough to know that.
Yes, there may be some difference between using a program like Zeus vs. home school link exchanging but, I still stick by my original statement.
With 1000+ inbound links, I don't think he'd be worrying about generating traffic and PR if they were inbound only. Not to fall back on old unreliable PR but, I think he'd be at least a steady 6-8 with that many inbound only links. I don't know how competitive the field is that his directory covers so, that could be a factor.
As to search engines ability to discriminate, they use a big brush to paint the multitude. If your number of exchanged links and other site factors trip the algo values they are using, you're going to be hurt in the rankings no matter how they were generated.
Yea. I dont think my directory can be considered as link farming. Each reciprocal link i acquired mostly are from begging from webmasters or at least giving them priority placement. And talking bout pr, nope. 1000 reciprocal links do not get me 6-8. I only have a mere 4 for the main page. Site has been online since last june. So i do not expect to get high pr so early. Age of site matters a lot in my opinion.
Now, if you can get inbound links from sites without having to link to them, you're cooking with gas.
Could you explain a more on this ... knotworking ? I am getting such requests lately and was really not sure if i should entertain such requests and go with it.
Also..I gave a thought and did some cross check with some directories which has high PR values ( not that I am PR obsessed, but yes all of us are traffic obsessed ! )...most of these high PR sites has little outbound links particulay in the way of recisprocal link exchange.
Untill recently I always wondered how they managed. But lately i understood they were employing this tactic....
Most webmasters have more than one portal. portal 1 and Portal 2...when They are asked to do reciprocal link exchange...they actually offer this.... I link to them to portal 1 and they link to my site from portal 2.
But i somehow feel this could be a major reason for PR leak ( not sure, if such a thing exists either...but I have read some threads abt it )...since there are only outbound links and they are not linking back to you from the same site.
can someone..throw some insights here... I am sure missing something.Looks like I have an answer to the doubt I have..but the answer itself looks doubtful to me because of the PR leak concept in my mind.
Thanks
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Comments on Search Engine Optimization with WSN Link
Forum Regular
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Jan 21, 2005
Total Topics: 32
Total Comments: 102
For directory websites, which one is better for external links considering the following?
1)Use direct url when linking to external links, e.g. http://externallink.com
2)Use the tracking feature of WSN links, e.g http://mysite.com/links/1234
3)Use a frame to frame out external links( Thanks Synozeer), e.g. http://mysite.com/frame.php?id=1234
4)use the rel="nofollow
Considering the first option, i guess most directory sites using this have a low pagerank. Am i correct? Because most pageranks are passed to outside links. And search engines will see your pages as no content because you only link out to others.
For second option, i was using the tracking and found it useful. I guess most directory websites using this have high page rank because of no external links at all. But since someone said in somewhere that this triggers the Google penalty because of webmasters 302 others page.
For third, some webmasters are suggesting not to use this because of ehtical issue. Masking others link are not ethical for some webmasters.
For fourth, never tried this, might give it a try?
What is your opinion? Feel free to correct me if i am wrong. I am still debating with myself of which options should i choose here.
Forum Regular
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Feb 19, 2004
Location: Michigan
Total Topics: 57
Total Comments: 185
As for #2 WSN Links uses 301 permanent redirects, not 302 temporary redirects, so it doesn't have that problem.
The most important thing is to do what is best for your viewers, then the traffic/rank will follow.
BTW, SE spiders can follow 301 and 302 redirects, so I don't think there is any difference between option 1 and 2. Unless you specify with "nofollow" tag, robots.txt, or in the header.
In general, if you provide links to high quality sites of a specific interest in a unique way, then this service will provide you with more traffic than the traffic that you would loose from the small reduction in page rank you were referring to.
As an example, look at DMOZ, they didn't loose all their page rank, and they don't do any shady stuff to try and keep it.
Yahoo uses redirects, but you still get PR from the yahoo dir.
Forum Regular
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Jan 21, 2005
Total Topics: 32
Total Comments: 102
SE Spiders can foolow 301 and 302? I did not know that.
And nofollow tag seems to be a myth sice some webmasters said that might be good or might be bad. And if i put a nofollow tag on every link, that will be a lot of nofollows.
Talking about shady stuff, i use a javascipt onmouseover trick to hide affiliate links. Is this recommended?
Also, i heard that the onclick trick can be used to prevent pr from passing. From WW forum.
Forum Regular
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Jan 21, 2005
Total Topics: 32
Total Comments: 102
Erm, i have been thinking of whether to put all my sponsored links with a nofollow tag. What do you guys think?
My site currently has over 1500 links and like 400 are sponsored. So there will be 400 nofollow tag links. Spammy?
Forum Regular
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Jan 21, 2005
Total Topics: 32
Total Comments: 102
Erm, i have been thinking a while and i need some suggestions.
I have a main site with a pr of 4. I am using direct linkout for external links. e.g. http://externallink.com instead of the tracking feature of WSN links. But i think i can boost up my pagerank by using the tracking feature and by putting up a robots.txt file indicating a disallow on mysite.com/links/
I thought of this because i am thinking search engines might think that my site has no content at all due to all external links.
But the problem is my link partners may be frowned upon what i did because i changed all to redirect feature. What do you guys think?
BTW, i run a craft directory websites listing all craft resources.
Experienced
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Mar 31, 2004
Total Topics: 20
Total Comments: 83
I think you might be wasting a lot of time on worrying about PR and outbound links. The advice a few posts up was about as good as you can get: worry about your viewers and users, traffic will follow.
Not to open the PR/Google can of worms but, here's my 2 cents worth of highlights:
-PR is a stale tool, Google themselves suggest not using it for anything more than anecdotal assessments.
-The practice of hording your PR by disguising outbound links will actually harm you with the current algorithyms, you should have at least 1-2 relevant outbound links to sites that fit the page topic.
-Link partners aren't worth a whole lot; sites that exchange links don't get much credit.
-Using all those nofollows along with javascript tricks is bound to get you penalized sooner or later.
If your concern is getting to the top of the results pages fast for a short amount of time, using whatever techniques you please. But if you want to build a site that has a long term presence, stay away from anything questionable.
I have a site that was created three years ago. It was on page 1 for several key terms on G for awhile, then Florida (a Google algorythym update) came along and sent me to the cellar. Seems all those META tags,ALT tages, and other content stuffing techniques I was using killed me. I didn't really get to concerned since, Yahoo changed at almost the same time and was sending me traffic to make up for that.
I recently stripped all that spammy content and overhauled the site (adding a few hundred pages). Soon after the Google traffic started coming back and Yahoo remains steady.
My advice would be to keep your content freash & clean and restrict your code use.
Forum Regular
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Jan 21, 2005
Total Topics: 32
Total Comments: 102
Thanks for all the comments.
-Link partners aren't worth a whole lot; sites that exchange links don't get much credit.
I run a directory website and there is nothing except oubound links with some description and some more details pages. So if you are looking for "contents" on my site, then the description and outbound links are considered as content. I am adding a lot of links lately and now my site exceeds 1600 links.
And if you say that links partners arent worth a penny, then there will be no value to my whole site. Since what i am doing now is putting others links up and exchange with them.
ANyways, i think i wont do anything to change the sructure for now. Making quite a penny for myself advertising. :>
Experienced
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Mar 31, 2004
Total Topics: 20
Total Comments: 83
There are plenty of Directories out there that rank really well with nothing but catagorized outbound links. Search Engines understand directories, IMO, and expect thousands of outbound links from them. What's going to hurt you is when all of the sites you link have a link right back to you on their pages. This type of link exchange has been out of favor for years.
Now, if you can get inbound links from sites without having to link to them, you're cooking with gas.
developer
Usergroup: Administrator
Joined: Dec 20, 2001
Location: Diamond Springs, California
Total Topics: 61
Total Comments: 7868
It sounds quite unlikely to me that there would be a penalty for mutual links.
Forum Regular
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Jan 21, 2005
Total Topics: 32
Total Comments: 102
What's going to hurt you is when all of the sites you link have a link right back to you on their pages. This type of link exchange has been out of favor for years.
I think reciprocal links still work but not as much benefit as one way link of course. My directory is built up upon reciprocal links mostly. I get some natural links of coruse but they are less than 100 i guess. While reciprocal links i get like 1000+
Experienced
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Mar 31, 2004
Total Topics: 20
Total Comments: 83
On the contrary, the practice is called link farming and can get you bounced right out of any relevant position in SERPs. It's a big no-no; a few won't probably hurt you but I'd think the amounts you are talking is putting you in danger. Do a Google search for "define:Link Farming" and you'll get their take on the practice of exchanging links.
developer
Usergroup: Administrator
Joined: Dec 20, 2001
Location: Diamond Springs, California
Total Topics: 61
Total Comments: 7868
Link farming is completely different from real link trading. Running Zeus or the like is not the same as exchanging links, and search engines are smart enough to know that.
Experienced
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Mar 31, 2004
Total Topics: 20
Total Comments: 83
Yes, there may be some difference between using a program like Zeus vs. home school link exchanging but, I still stick by my original statement.
With 1000+ inbound links, I don't think he'd be worrying about generating traffic and PR if they were inbound only. Not to fall back on old unreliable PR but, I think he'd be at least a steady 6-8 with that many inbound only links. I don't know how competitive the field is that his directory covers so, that could be a factor.
As to search engines ability to discriminate, they use a big brush to paint the multitude. If your number of exchanged links and other site factors trip the algo values they are using, you're going to be hurt in the rankings no matter how they were generated.
At least, that's how it looks to me from here.
Forum Regular
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Jan 21, 2005
Total Topics: 32
Total Comments: 102
Yea. I dont think my directory can be considered as link farming. Each reciprocal link i acquired mostly are from begging from webmasters or at least giving them priority placement. And talking bout pr, nope. 1000 reciprocal links do not get me 6-8. I only have a mere 4 for the main page. Site has been online since last june. So i do not expect to get high pr so early. Age of site matters a lot in my opinion.
Internet Evangelist
Usergroup: Customer
Joined: Oct 18, 2003
Total Topics: 43
Total Comments: 103
Could you explain a more on this ... knotworking ? I am getting such requests lately and was really not sure if i should entertain such requests and go with it.
Also..I gave a thought and did some cross check with some directories which has high PR values ( not that I am PR obsessed, but yes all of us are traffic obsessed ! )...most of these high PR sites has little outbound links particulay in the way of recisprocal link exchange.
Untill recently I always wondered how they managed. But lately i understood they were employing this tactic....
Most webmasters have more than one portal. portal 1 and Portal 2...when They are asked to do reciprocal link exchange...they actually offer this.... I link to them to portal 1 and they link to my site from portal 2.
But i somehow feel this could be a major reason for PR leak ( not sure, if such a thing exists either...but I have read some threads abt it )...since there are only outbound links and they are not linking back to you from the same site.
can someone..throw some insights here... I am sure missing something.Looks like I have an answer to the doubt I have..but the answer itself looks doubtful to me because of the PR leak concept in my mind.
Thanks